I haven’t been able to get this thread out of my mind.
The victim of the abuse (her child in this case) does not put the Enabling Mother in the position of choosing him over his Abusive Father, at least not initially. He just wants the Enabler to call a Wrong a Wrong and…
Clever idea. However, the best evidence that Loki was always planning to get himself “killed” and then come back and impersonate Odin is that when being taken away for an eternity of isolation in the dungeons of Asgard, he asks if Odin plans to make Thor king. He wouldn’t need to know this unless he was planning to make use of the fact.
So I was watching Thor 2 again, and something occurred to me…
Does anyone else think that it was Kurse’s blood that saved Loki’s life?
I mean, let’s look back at this scene
Malekith stabs Algrim with the knife which would probably be either a death wound or near close to…
Never accept an ice bucket challenge from a frost giant holding the Casket of Ancient Winters
Heimdall takes the Ice Bucket Challenge.
one question: when you wrote about Thor, “that he understands now what Odin meant, and clearly Loki does not yet,” what are you referring to? otherwise most excellent points, thanks to all.
In speaking of conventional Western morality in the context of the Marvel films, relating to the treatment of Asgard, I think it’s necessary to…
"I won’t be the one who comes for her."
Thor. You have four friends there, all of whom will do anything you ask them to. So which one of them do you ask to go fetch your new girlfriend? The one who’s in love with you, whose heart is broken by her very existence.
Thor, you are a shithead.
about nine realms and gotg connection and universe lately. I just have to say that heimdall didn´t see loki´s survival in universe. He didn´t see his alliance (or whatever it was) with thanos and he didn´t see how chitauri army formed. If he would, asgard would react sooner so loki etc wouldn´t be able to reach earth. I just think that asgard is really powerless as for realms outsite nine realms. They probably don´t even know about thanos and his huge power. Asgard don´t know what´s going on.
Don´t get me wrong, I love asgard but I think that it is really powerless realm against rest of the universe (not including nine realms but this what we saw in gotg). Asgard only thinks it is ruler of everything and has everything under his thumb but they only think this. The true is that their ignorance to powerful villains (like thanos) could be end of asgard. Just look at advanced state of weapons of aliens in universe and asgardians (who hold swords like in middle ages). Asgard has no chance
You’re assuming a lot here against some fairly reasonable conclusions we have from canon. Heimdall couldn’t see Loki going to Jotunheim, we know that he’s able to hide himself from Heimdall’s gaze, so it’s reasonable to assume that Heimdall didn’t see any of that because Loki was hidden from him.
And they were able to see them somehow, because it was Thor who brought up the name “Chitauri” to the Avengers (and specifically says that no other world knew about them, implying that Asgard either asked—which was a pretty short time to ask, like, a day or less—or else they’re connected strongly to those other worlds and know what they know), which makes it reasonable to assume that they were able to gather info/Heimdall could turn his gaze there, once they had an idea of where to look.
As for Asgard’s weaponry, we can see they’re not just swords, as I’ve talked about in this post. You can see in those caps that there’s some sort of energy lighting up those weapons, they’re not just plain iron or steel. Just because they prefer handheld weaponry doesn’t mean that there’s not more there, that it’s not more advanced than it looks! Also, they have the Bifrost, which the whole point of the end of the first Thor movie is that Loki was using it to rip an ENTIRE PLANET apart, if Asgard wanted to destroy a planet, it would take them MINUTES to do so. From a distance, they wouldn’t even have to be in orbit around the planet.
And Asgard has never said that they view all of the other planets as under their thumbs, the most you hear Odin say is that he’s the protector of the Nine Realms. It seems pretty clear that, if there’s a connection between, say, Asgard and the Nova Corps, they respect each other and let each other run their own business. Hell, even Midgard is under Asgard’s protection and Asgard doesn’t do anything to interfere in Midgard’s ruling, aside from getting their own stuff back. (The Tesseract is theirs, it was left on Midgard by Asgard.)
They don’t even rule Jotunheim, where they would have a really good reason to do so. Instead, they leave Jotunheim’s business up to Jotunheim, once they’ve taken the Casket (which Jotunheim used to attack other worlds, intending to subjugate those worlds), as far as we see, they don’t want to rule any place but Asgard.
And we know that Asgard is likely a major power even beyond the Bifrost. They were able to defeat the Dark Elves in Bor’s time and get the Aether (an Infinity Stone) because Malekith had abused it, and it was Malekith’s sneak attack and Odin’s grief that left them vulnerable. They got their Tesseract back and voluntarily chose to give up the second Infinity Stone because they recognize the danger of having two close together like that. But they were the ones who gathered more than one Infinity Stone, which says they probably could go after more, but they choose not to.
We don’t know how much they know about Thanos, if they’re aware of him or not. We know the Collector seemed pretty deferential to the Asgardians, but how much that’s just Tivan himself or that they’re major players, we don’t know. We know they can get to Knowhere, so it’s reasonable to assume they could have dropped people on Xandar just fine, so why don’t they? The Bifrost was repaired by then… so, it’s entirely reasonable to assume they don’t, because that planet is under the protection of the Nova Corps and Asgard doesn’t interfere, just as the Nova Corps don’t interfere when Asgard is under attack, unless they had been asked.
So, ultimately, my point isn’t that Asgard are the top dogs of the universe, but instead that they’re powerful players when they choose to be. There’s a lot of stuff that we just don’t know about, but it’s reasonable to assume that Asgard’s a powerful ally, but they don’t get involved unless they’re asked or they/the realms directly under their protection are threatened.
And, yeah, a lot of my stuff is assumptions, too! And I don’t mean for this to come across as snippy (but I suspect I failed on that—sincere apologies!), as well as I try to be clear when I’m theorizing about stuff. I don’t think Marvel will give Asgard as much credit as I’d like, but we have been shown that they have a lot of weapons at their disposal that are incredibly powerful and that they are connected, at least somewhat to these other places, when they want to be.
Personally, I keep hoping that what Loki’s been up to will turn out to have been part of his and Odin’s plan to sort out any potential problems before they have to deal with the Surtur threat.
I mean, Earth is a resource rich planet that would make an excellent place to build an armada and it’s populated by a smart inventive technology undeveloped species who can build it for you as well as being connected to the other 9 realms of the world tree making it an excellent starting point for empire expansion. There are two issues though: any attempt to invade will get your head stoved in by the Aesir for trespassing on their patch and even if they weren’t an issue, Earth’s ridiculously hard to get to without the right know-how. And then the tesseract is found and suddenly Earth isn’t so far away after all. The problem then is how to get there without getting your arse handed to you.
And then a lucky break: a dissatisfied princeling shows up who knows how to travel the 9 realms unseen and whose failed attempt at a coup of his home kingdom has taken out not only the bifrost, but the only other race in the 9 realms who care what goes on on Midgard- the Jotuns- leaving Earth undefended for the first time in millennia. And so a deal is made- Loki gets to be King of Midgard in exchange for the tesseract- and send off the useful idiot off to pave the way for your troops. You can bump him off when he’s served his purpose.
Except it doesn’t work out that way. The entire invasion fleet is wiped out in about 20 minutes by 5 Midgarders, 1 Aesir and a really big bomb. Twenty minutes. The mighty Thanos cannot even defeat Earth, the weakest of the 9 realms. And now the entire galaxy knows it.
Odin’s sphere of influence is once again free from outside interference. Laufey is dead and his replacement is hopefully more amenable to lasting piece. Thanos is neutralised. The thing with the Svartalfs was unfortunate, but does give the old man the perfect excuse to let Loki out of prison without being seen to do so on purpose (poor Thor, getting moved about like a chess piece) as Thanos still has spies on Asgard who need to be taken out and who will happily slit Loki’s throat for having led their master so merrily up the garden path if they realise he was never on their side.
But it won’t turn out that way. I may write a fanfic instead, but really Marvel need to seriously up their game with the Thor films as they’re the weakest of the entire franchise. And I say that as someone who loves the films!
If it were up to me—and this will never happen, both because Marvel doesn’t want to get this complicated a Thor franchise plot, but also because I suspect Anthony Hopkins is just done with the character and I can’t blame him after TDW—what I would do is make Odin and Loki’s actions part of a bigger plot related to Thanos.
I do enjoy the Xanatos Gambit theory with Loki, I think it made a neat amount of sense with the plot of The Avengers (though, I think TDW kind of shut it down because nothing is connected in a way that would build up to it, they had no way of knowing about the Aether being out there, there’s no mention of Thanos, etc.), and what I would love for the ending of the movie to mean is that Loki took Odin’s place with Odin’s blessing.
That Odin said, “Now that Midgard is safe from Thanos’ hands, you will take my place, pretend to be me, so that it appears Asgard has no idea what’s going on, while I go out and investigate what’s happening with Thanos.” Because Thanos is blocked from Midgard (for now, it’s entirely possible that Avengers 3 will deal with Thanos) and so it’s safe, but there are still a shitload of other planets to worry about and the Infinity Stones are something that Asgard is tied up in.
As much as I enjoy the idea of Loki running around and trying to unravel Thanos’ plans, I love the idea of Odin doing it even more. After the loss of his wife, he’d need to go out traveling to get his head on straight again, plus he’s still stronger than Loki and has been walking the pathways between the worlds since a hell of a long time before that little shit was even born.
Meanwhile, Thor isn’t told of this because they don’t think he’d be okay with what was necessary and Thor could tear down their plans, if he wanted. Eventually, Asgard will join the fight against Thanos, as I love the idea that it would take a joining of many worlds and many powers together, the Avengers, Thor as a representative of Asgard, the GotG crew, maybe the Nova Corps, and a lot of the info they get comes from Odin having sought out more information and the necessary tools/artifacts to help them in this fight.
It’ll never happen, but I CAN DREAM ABOUT IT.
Nuclear physics, energy politics, and why Howard Stark had to die
love this!!! However, SHIELD is based in D.C., and the 1953 interview with Peggy in the Smithsonian has her in New York. So possibly HYDRA eased her out of the main chain of command. It would have been very easy for them to convince everyone, including her, that sexism did in her career. Meanwhile, I completely agree with the rest of this post.
In The Winter Soldier, Arnim Zola all but brags outright that Howard Stark’s “accidental” death was in fact caused by HYDRA. The Russo brothers have apparently confirmed that they meant to implicate the Winter Soldier in the assassination, which opens the door for all sorts of fun pain and angst once we get Bucky back and he starts interacting with Tony… but that’s not actually what I want to talk about here.
No, the real question I want to address is: Why Howard, and not Peggy?
How can you make the two greatest assassins in the universe completely useless and boring?someone needs to make a swim-two-birds out of the Marvel universe. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/At_Swim-Two-Birds
I loved GotG, but this is fantastic and true.
just like to add that Thor just had essentially the same conversation with Heimdall: “How fare the stars?” “Still shining.”
Okay. But let’s talk about Thor for a second. Thor does not get enough love and (Loki forgive me) he is honestly one of the best fucking characters Marvel has. And it’s shown so simply and so beautifully right here. He is so fucking chill about everything. Obviously, he doesn’t live in space, he lives in Asgard. But he knows everyone thinks he’s kinda like an alien, and he just goes along with it because why not? These humans are funny in their lack of understanding, but it’s an endearing kind of funny. Just like in the first movie, where Darcy tells him to smile so she can take a picture of him and he has no fucking clue what she’s doing or what a phone is and it could kill him for all he knows but he just fucking smiles and keeps eating his delicious pancakes because he’s just so chill like that. And if you look at his face in the first gif, it’s very serious and concentrated but the moment Darcy starts talking to him he loosens up and is like “Muscles? Ah, yes I suppose I am quite muscular. Oh, she’s inquiring about Asgard. But she called it space. She seems confused as to my origins, but it’s not of import. I like space, that’s a good name. I shall call it space too.”
And that little head nod he does back to her in the last gif. I’m dead. Deceased. Murdered from Thor cuteness.
He’s just.. ugh, Thor doesn’t get enough appreciation. There are so many little things he does that go ignored but no more. His complete adorableness will be appreciated.
I DIDN’T NOTICE THE LITTLE NOD BACK /SCREEEEEEEEE
Part of this is certainly based on his sweet, open nature, but part will also be biology. The reason why his species was so evolutionarily successful is most likely that they adapt so quickly to new situations and surroundings, different planets and so on. Thor is super quick at noticing what’s going on around him, what people belonging to other species say and do and how they mean it, so he knows when a human is joking and when not, and which words he needs to use in order to be understood.
Still, if he was an arrogant alien arse, he could just dismiss this behaviour as lowly, but being the fluffteddy Marvel’s Thor (movie version) is, he plays along and enjoys the banter. He likes making new friends, he needs new friends desperately in the first movie, and the Lord knows this dude doesn’t have much to smile about by the time of the second - so why miss a chance?
//Can I just say i love your blog and agree with pretty much everything on here?
I am writing some AO3 fic in which I demonstrate that Loki is in fact playing the long game against Thanos. I haven’t put anything up yet since I want to rough out at least one full draft before I start posting so that I don’t feel that I have to go back and change anything already up. But stay tuned - you’ll see that Loki will be vindicated yet.
FWIW I’m pretty sure that Loki will be Thanos’ ultimate antagonist later on at some point during the whole cycle of Marvel movies. I collected a lot of Marvel comics back in high school in the 80’s and 90’s so I suspect I know a little more about the Infinity Gems than most of the rest of the people who saw Gotg. Keep up the good work and thank you for your kind words.